Welcome to Ghost of a Podcast. I'm your host, Jessica Lanyadoo. I'm an astrologer, psychic medium, and animal communicator, and I'm going to give you your weekly horoscope and no-bullshit mystical advice for living your very best life.

Strap in. This is going to be a great episode. I had the honor of Reverend Erika Forbes joining me for a conversation about Roe v. Wade and her path with activism. But within 24 hours of recording, Roe v. Wade was overturned. And so we hopped on another call to discuss the chart of the overturning of Roe. So you're going to hear both parts of the conversation in this episode, and yeah. It's a goodie. Enjoy.

Jessica: So, Erika, welcome to Ghost of a Podcast.  I was so excited by your question, and I'm not sure how it's going to shake out, but why don't you just tell me what you want to talk about, and we'll get into it?

Erika: Well, I really want to talk about the direction of the reproductive justice movement in light of the decision that is going to be handed down, we know, within a matter of days. In particular, because I work in reproductive justice work and because I'm very up front as a minister I have had two abortions⁠—and I speak openly about it, and it's part of why I've been involved in this work so deeply and for so long⁠—I'd love to understand how my work or anyone who wants to work in reproductive justice, especially after this decision is handed down⁠—where they should go, what's the best avenue, and what Roe v. Wade⁠—the end of Roe v. Wade as we know it⁠—will mean for the landscape of reproductive justice and the direction we should take the movement in.

Jessica: Okay. Those are such important questions. And just⁠—could you share a couple words about your work and how you've come to movement and your role within it so I can also point you in directions?

Erika: Sure. I got in the work right after my second abortion at 18. I started volunteering for a national organization that does provide abortion care. And then I went on to teaching, and then I slowly moved back into reproductive justice work. And just within the last three months, I tried to leave reproductive justice work and go back into corporate America, and that was a disaster. And so I came back to it because I was called to speak, and I actually decided to start my own reproductive justice strategic planning firm⁠—

Jessica: Amazing.

Erika: ⁠—because I knew this was coming, and I knew that we were going to have to change everything that we've ever done in this movement. I'm 52, or I'll be 52 February 1st. So I'm part of the decision. And I was also a plaintiff because I live in Texas; I was one of the lead individual plaintiffs on the S.B. 8 Supreme Court decision that we took to the Supreme Court. So I'm very entrenched in the movement, and now my decision is to help frame the movement moving forward. And so I'm trying to understand what my role is so that I can help guide other people in the movement and who want to be in this movement in the direction that it needs to go. But I need to at least have some deeper sense of what that could look like.

Jessica: Yeah. Thank you for sharing all that. It's really powerful, and it's like my brain is going in multiple directions at once. Part of me feels like the thing I should be doing is pulling up your chart and talking about your chart, and then part of me feels like what I should be doing is talking about the Roe v. Wade chart. Do you have an instinct if you want to start big or more focused on you?

Erika: I think it's important to start big and then filter down because we need to understand, okay, here's what the potential of the landscape can be, and then what's our marching orders? What's my marching orders, and then how can I help lead the movement?

Jessica: Yep. Great. Okay. I love this. So I've got the chart for Roe v. Wade here. It was established January 22nd, 1973. I've got at 10:00 a.m. in Washington, D.C. And so this chart is interesting. It has a stellium in Capricorn, interestingly.

Erika: Oh.

Jessica: Yeah. And it has a Venus conjunction to the North Node, so it is a ruling that is specifically for the benefit and autonomy of women. Big surprise there. But in this chart, we have a Mars/Saturn opposition. A very overly simplistic articulation of this is from the get, men have been trying to stop it. Men have been in opposition. Literally, this is the only planetary opposition in the whole chart. It's between Mars and Saturn, the patriarchy and individual man. And unfortunately, this kind of divisiveness that we see in this chart is pretty consistent⁠—it's not like there's exclusively men who are against Roe v. Wade, but it is patriarchal.

And this is right now not getting triggered at this particular point, but it's worth naming it. Unfortunately, what is getting triggered right now is the Mercury to this chart. We have Mercury in the chart at 28 degrees of Capricorn, and Pluto is sitting on top of it. And so this is where it is like a shift around the conversation we're having and around public opinion. Because of that, there is a great power in storytelling. In this day of social media, that's not shocking. But as individual people share their stories about their lived experience, that is a source of power. But unfortunately, wherever Pluto is involved, power can be used against us.

Erika: That's⁠—it's really interesting because⁠—and I'll just really digress really quick⁠—

Jessica: Please.

Erika: ⁠—is to say that my sense for my own self is that part of my role in the reproductive justice movement is to help bring in⁠—and this is going to sound crazy, I know⁠—is to bring in, actually, men to tell their abortion stories and to help facilitate a different kind of thinking about who talks about abortion and who can help us shift the narrative. And it is honestly not probably popular to say we need men's voices in this movement. There's no other way. And for me, as I've been Queer all of my life and now am engaged to a man⁠—but I just cannot⁠—and a white man at that, so there's that.

So I cannot help but think that there's no way we can create a new landscape without men in this movement. And I'm terrified of having to say that in the movement, and also, how in the world am I going to convince our movement, after seeing what men have done to systematically destroy Roe v. Wade, that actually we have to call them in and we have to train them up? I have no idea how I'm going to do that.

Jessica: I'm so excited to hear you say all of this because it matches the astrology. I'm going to talk about it in the context of your birth chart in a few minutes, but let's stay with this chart because what you're saying⁠—it makes a lot of sense with the chart because when we're dealing with Saturn and Pluto, two important figures in this chart at this moment for different reasons⁠—but when we're dealing with this, what we're really talking about is people with systemic power, people with historical power. So it's not just, oh, they have power in this moment. But they've always had power.

When it becomes their issue, when they leverage their power, not just for us but for what is good and right, it does change the conversation. And I can't stress this enough: we have this Mercury in the Roe v. Wade chart at 28 degrees of Capricorn. Pluto is sitting directly on top of it. It is really an important moment for us to engage with the Plutonian theme of who benefits from abortion. Men benefit from abortion, not just women. And of course, there's more genders than male and female; that is important to name. But when we're having this conversation about Roe v. Wade from the chart, that was not a consideration in the creation of this chart. It was a boy/girl conversation, and it's reflected in the chart, this very binary approach.

This was in the early 1970s, where women going to work was still a question in a major way. Women being financially autonomous was still very much a question. It was not like an assumption in the same way it is now. And again, it's reflected in the chart. And I've got to say that what comes next⁠—so this transit, this Pluto conjunction to Mercury, it won't be over until January of 2024. And it's going to remain tumultuous, dramatic, and we are going to see some of the worst and some of the best of us around this issue through this period. But then, just within a month of that transit ending, Pluto conjoins the Sun, the identity of Roe v. Wade. That's another two-year period.

So part of what really excited me about your question is it's my perspective that we are in the beginning of a several-year-long process of the public opinion and identity of Roe v. Wade becoming a much bigger deal, and again, we'll see the worst and best of us. It's Pluto. We'll definitely see the worst of us. But I definitely think that bringing in men and people of all genders is an important part of this. But within that, because we're dealing with Pluto and this is happening during the Pluto Return of the United States⁠—this is an important detail⁠—and because of the Saturn/Mars opposition that is deep in this chart, some of the changes that need to happen have to happen within the system. I think a lot of times, with progressives, we want to make change outside of the system and then have it impact the system, and I think that's deeply important. But this chart articulates they need to happen from within the system, which is again to your point about men.

Erika: There's somehow we're also going to have to shift the conversation to bring in people of different religious beliefs, and on top of that, we're going to have to shift⁠—and this is a really big deal⁠—that we are not just talking about this impacts those that are marginalized the most because it allows everyone else who isn't to opt out. And I'm like, "Oh my God. How is this going to happen?"⁠—so that what we're creating is a movement where everyone sees that this is critical to everyone's existence. And you might as well tell me to build an ark. I don't know. I don't know; how am I going to—and it's going to be challenging because I cannot let my Caucasian sisters opt out or my wealthy sisters opt out or those that have power opt out, or anyone. And I don't really⁠—that seems like a lot.

Jessica: It is a lot. Let's get to your chart. Okay. So you were born February 1st, 1971, at 12:31 a.m. in San Leandro, California, right here where I am. So what you're talking about is so important. Now, listen. I look at your birth chart. You've got this Neptune/Jupiter/Mars conjunction in your first house in Sagittarius. Yeah, you want to change the fucking world. Yeah, you don't mind if it takes you your whole life. You don't mind if it takes tons of personal sacrifice. I mean, you're very impatient by nature, but you're willing to do the work because you're so idealistic as well, eh?

Erika: Yeah.

Jessica: Within that as well, you've got Moon in Aries in the sixth house. You are emotionally driven to do the work that you do. If you don't care, you don't do shit. When you care, you do everything.

Erika: Yes.

Jessica: Yeah. And on top of it, you've got this T-square. I don't always count a Midheaven and a T-square, but in your case, I will. You've got a Sun opposition to the Midheaven and both of those points square to Saturn in the seventh house. And so this is the part of you that's like, "If I make a commitment to a thing⁠—to a person or to a cause or to an ambition⁠—I don't care what it cost me. I don't care how many years. I will do the fucking thing." You are going through so much astrologically right now, and that's where I want to kind of focus, what you were just saying of, "How am I going to get people motivated? How do we impress upon people that it is an every-one-of-us issue, not just the most marginalized, not just women, etc.?"

And this brings me to your Venus. You've got this Venus as part of your Sagittarius stellium in the second house. And Venus in the second house makes you incredibly values-driven. For you, everything comes down to what you value. Most of the time, when I say to people, "What are the things you value?" they stutter. They don't really know what I mean. I have to define the word for them. It's really weird. You, I'm sure you have a scroll. It's engraved in your back pocket. You know what you value. You have, really, a passionate relationship to values.

And currently, we've got Neptune squaring your Venus, which can be quite a dramatic and demoralizing transit. It's a once-in-a-lifetime event. What it does is it can spark idealism to the point where you lose track of yourself or you don't care for yourself because you're doing so much for others. At the same time, you've got Uranus sitting on top of your Saturn. So it's placing stress on this part of you that is used to doing everything in your relationships. Coalition building? I'll build it. So you mentioned building an ark, and I was like, we gotta pull up your chart because that's kind of how your brain works. You're like, "I'll build a fucking ark. I don't care who gets on it. Let's just all get on it, and it'll work."

And that is what makes you impactful. It's what allows you to do all the things you've done in your life. It is also not sustainable. Asking people to show up and to kind of put out, to do the work, is hard regardless of your birth chart⁠—I mean regardless of the cause. But luckily, you currently have Pluto forming a trine to your Pluto. So you have Pluto currently transiting through your third house, and it is trining your eleventh-house Pluto. So, I mean, as soon as I pulled up your chart, I was like, "Oh shit. You're going to move some mountains." You actually have the ability to effectively communicate collective need through collective fear and to mobilize communities, groups of people, not just individuals.

But if you source all the wood and find the open field to build the ark and you try to get your own hammers and nails and you watch YouTube videos to figure out how to build boats⁠—if you do all that on your own, you run the risk because of this Neptune transit⁠—also because common sense, right, but because of this Neptune transit⁠—of taxing your nervous system and having your physical body impact that. Have you noticed that at all in 2022?

Erika: Actually, well, yeah, because at the end of 2021, I was diagnosed with high blood pressure. That's why I left the movement, and then I went into corporate America. And I didn't even know what a gallbladder was, and right at my birthday, I had an emergency gallbladder surgery while I was on vacation by myself. And I was like, "Okay, body. I get it. There's obviously something I'm not listening to." I've practiced Bikram Yoga for the last 12 years, and I'm a vegan. I do all the things. This isn't making any sense to me. So it must be my life. And so I learned the hard way. It's just the way I do it.

Jessica: I was going to say that's your favorite way. You're kind of into it. You're super into it. I mean, it's the beauty of being resilient and having vision and having passion is that you can take it to the edge. The problem is, when you fall off the edge, it's kind of a heavy drop. And that's part of the lesson you're learning as a person, as an individual, beautifully fragile human person. And I think we're all fragile. I think so many of us are strong, but the human body is⁠—

Erika: It's so temporal. It's all heavy, and it's dense, and you can just poke it and it falls apart, and liquid.

Jessica: Liquid.

Erika: I just don't know how we have these human bodies. It's so⁠—they're slow.

Jessica: They're slow, and they're built to break.

Erika: Yeah.

Jessica: And let's add more complexity. You currently have transiting Pluto squaring your Moon. And your Moon is in the sixth house. And so this fun combo platter of age⁠—but honestly, this would be happening regardless of your age, but the older we are, the more it's likely to show up in the body, right? The real combo platter to pay attention to is Neptune's squaring your Venus, Pluto's squaring your Moon, and Uranus is sitting on top of Saturn. And so this all comes together to say⁠—and this is so important for you to hear and also hopefully for your friends and your fiancé to hear⁠—that your physical body and your nervous system can take a lot, but they can't take it all. And having limits and boundaries is essential to sustaining the work.

That means sometimes you have to say to someone else, "I know where the wood is. It would be easier for me to go get it, but could you do it, please? Because I actually just need to stare at a wall." You need that. Neptune wants us⁠—unfortunately, demands⁠ that we step away from the world sometimes to nurture our sensitivities.

Erika: Right, and I take an extraordinary amount of self-care time. I mean, it takes me four hours of meditation and yoga and running and swimming just to put together three hours of work. I feel like I take an exorbitant amount of time.

Jessica: And that's [indiscernible 00:19:51].

Erika: And I'm an introvert, so I have to hunker down. That's all I do, is just nurture myself and do the work. So I can't function without an extreme amount, I think, of self-care; it feels like too much.

Jessica: Okay. Definitely not too much. I'm really glad to hear it, and this is the joy of adulthood. You figured it out, and you know what you need. However, I have an instinct about something. Say your full name out loud so I can really check it.

Erika: Erika Lyn Forbes.

Jessica: Okay. Some of what you do for self-care is more labor. It's organized. It's consistent. And that's what works for you. Got Moon in the sixth house. It's perfect. You got Saturn as a focal planet to a T-square. This is what you're meant to do. This is highly effective. Here's the but, because you know there's a but. The but is because of fucking Uranus sitting on top of your Saturn, what that transit does is many things, but a big one is that it changes your internal structure as a human being, your relationship to reality and consistency.

So what you're likely to experience is some of the structured things that you do to be efficient or to be healthy might feel oppressive, or they may not be as effective. Right? So you've been noticing that?

Erika: Yeah.

Jessica: Okay. So I'm going to give you a very anti-Capricorn⁠—because you know I'm very, very Capricorn. I'm going to give you anti-Capricorn advice here, and I'm going to say experiment with changing your routine because what you've just described is the healthiest, smartest routines in the world. Why would anyone ever tell you to stop? It's because your body is telling you it's not exactly working. Some of the things you do to maintain and protect yourself⁠—I mean, they're all effective, but some of the things, you're doing it in a way where it's like more labor. And Uranus wants change. And what Neptune wants is rest and repose. And so yoga can be rest and repose. Meditation can be rest and repose. I mean, ideally, it is. And sometimes it's more work.

Erika: Right, because I do it with a discipline and a rigor and an absoluteness that is⁠—there's no cut cards. There's no negotiation. I hold myself hostage to that routine because it's⁠—yeah.

Jessica: Right. Okay. So now you used Pluto words. You said you hold yourself hostage, and Pluto is squaring your Moon. So anything that we are held hostage by that does not effectively serve our evolution, whether it's through our behavior or through the motivation of the behavior, when we're going through Pluto transits that are hard like you are, it roots it out. And so what I want to encourage you to do is to be willing to experiment with engaging with your self-care tools in new and adjusted ways and to be with that perfectionism because your perfectionism⁠—and this is something you may have heard me say before, but perfectionism is really⁠—it's a really highly effective unhealthy behavior and motivation. And it's so effective that⁠—why would you change it?

And the answer to why is because if you don't, your body will suffer. Your psyche will suffer. So you could do all the right things, quote unquote, and still the gallbladder thing. You're like, "What the fuck?" And it was your system saying, "Slow down. Step back. Have a damn seat."

Erika: Right.

Jessica: So I'm not saying this because I'm trying to take you away from the cause and the work. In fact, it's quite the opposite. It's, sometimes, taking the straightest path is the most efficient way to get there, and sometimes the most efficient way to get there is taking the winding path because when you get there, you're ready to do the damn work. And this is really hard because this Neptune/Jupiter/Mars in the front of your chart in your first house⁠—you can kind of lose yourself in puttering, theoretically. I'm guessing you don't let yourself. But perhaps when you were younger, you did it. It can get⁠, you know—

Erika: Just floating around doing aimless things that aren't even directive.

Jessica: Yep. Yep. Am I reading this correctly, that you did that when you were younger, and then you figured out how to get around it and how to work with it, and now you don't?

Erika: Right.

Jessica: Okay. This is a part of you. This part of you, the floop-a-doop part, it's a part of you. And achieving wholeness means achieving wholeness. It's super annoying. And so part of what the astrology of this moment is trying to force down your damn throat is to integrate your need for rest and floop-a-doop and nothing much, and to trust yourself enough to be able to do that as a form of self-care and as a form of your health and to have faith in that. Now, I'm not encouraging you just trust it out the gate. I'm encouraging you to experiment with it.

The next time you're like, "Okay. I've got to do my three hours of self-care," if your body's like, "Rrrr," or your brain's like, "This sounds like torture. I don't want to do it," maybe schedule two hours of your rigorous self-care and then one hour where you do the uncomfortable work of just chilling out, or 20 minutes of the chilling and 2 hours and 40 minutes of the rigorous self-care. I just want to encourage you to experiment because⁠—back to the larger issue at play⁠—you are incredibly capable of moving some fucking mountains here, but if you move mountains and then you collapse at the base of it, then those are all the mountains you get to move. No more mountains for you.

And this is a really difficult thing. I don't want to encourage you to be less passionate, less driven, less effective. I want to encourage you to think about how you can sustain all of that because this is a very fucking long fight, and it will get much worse, as you know, before it gets better.

Erika: Yeah. Yeah. You're absolutely right, and I just came off of two days where I was supposed to do my yoga and all my practice, but I was so dog tired from the travel that I literally couldn't, and I was mad. But then on the third day, Wednesday⁠—today's Thursday⁠—I woke up and I was like, "Oh. I feel great." But the two days of not doing what I had planned to do was just⁠—it was painful. So yes. I mean, literally just finished trying it, so I do know there must be value to it.

Jessica: I mean, and the timing. What are the chances that we'd have a reading where I'm a triple Capricorn being like, "You need to relax"? But it's true. When you're not used to slowing down and landing in the system, what happens when you do is you find all the emotions that are not getting tended to: irritability, agitation, sadness, all the things. And they don't get directed at an external foe, and then you become the internal foe, and it's a mild form of torture. So it's about being more habitual with that mild form of torture so it just gets uncomfortable, and then it goes from uncomfortable to just the same way as all of the other self-care. It's like, "Yeah, it's a little difficult, but I know it's good for me."

And this period of your life, it's two more years. You got two more years. So you've got a lot of time to learn this lesson. But the Universe does not care how you learn. Easy, hard, miserable? Your call. And you've already had some health stuff, so we want to make⁠—it's like I'm like, "We must protect you at all costs." So this is where I say tell your friends, tell your fiancé, because they can annoy you about it, and then you can be like, "No, no, no," and then think about it yourself and then come around to it or remember it, because I do see that it's important that things are your idea, like you really want things to be your idea.

Erika: My fiancé is going to crack up when he hears this. He's not even into astrology, because he's a science person. I'm going to play that little piece because he's going to be like, "Told you." 100 percent.

Jessica: Everything has to be your idea; otherwise, it's not a good idea. So, when people say things to you frequently enough, it starts to feel like your idea, and you're cool with that. But he⁠—can I peek at him real quick? What's his name?

Erika: His name is [redacted].

Jessica: Okay. He's really supportive. Do you let him help you with organizational stuff?

Erika: Yeah, because he's a systems thinker, and I⁠—

Jessica: I see that.

Erika: ⁠—and that's what he brings in is all of the⁠—because I have the vision, but he has the way to do it. And he brings me in in a way that is intelligent and not insulting. I mean, he has to be smart in order to be with me.

Jessica: Agreed.

Erika: So yeah.

Jessica: He's very methodical, very systematic, very organized, and he's⁠—I don't want this to come across a weird way, but he's dispassionate in a way that is really effective to have behind the scenes in a movement⁠—

Erika: Absolutely.

Jessica: ⁠—not at the front of a movement. You've got the passion for that.

Erika: Yeah. Yeah. He's the balancer, and he's able to hear it from a non-attached point. That doesn't mean he doesn't care, but he's not attached to an outcome, because⁠—science.

Jessica: Yep. Yep. And he's also not attached to the process, which you really need right now because there's a part of what you're doing that is needing to evolve in this shifting landscape that we're finding ourselves in. And so he's going to have some weird, subtle ideas that are just subtly different that you're going to be like, "That's not how we do it." But I want to encourage you to be like, "Oh, right. But I'm going through a Uranus transit, so maybe I need to explore this."

Erika: Well, he's the person that saved my life because the blood pressure⁠—he happened to go to the doctor with me that day. I wouldn't have gone to the emergency room, and he said, "Just⁠—I'm going to ask one favor. Would you do this for me?" And it saved my life. And with the gallbladder, I was like, "I'm not going to the hospital. I'm in Florida. I don't know anything." He said, "Please." Two times. And my mother died at 47. So two times since I've met him, he's literally⁠—no lie⁠—saved my life.

Jessica: That's really powerful.

Erika: Yeah.

Jessica: I'm so happy to hear that. Are you getting married, or are you just being affianced?

Erika: No. We are getting married October 22nd this year.

Jessica: Congratulations. That's great.

Erika: Thanks. Yeah.

Jessica: Congratulations. I was going to be like, "He's a keeper, whatever you do. He's a keeper. We're going to hold on to him." I also just want to validate this is not a person who's going to tell you what to do, which is really important because obviously you wouldn't partner with him if he did. But part of where you're at is⁠—it sounds complicated, but I'll just say what I'm seeing. It's like this thing that you named at the beginning where you're just like, "We gotta bring men into the movement in a new way, and kind of a bigger way, not where they take it over, but where they use their voice." Right?

Erika: Mm-hmm.

Jessica: And part of what I'm seeing is that that's going to require an adjustment from you. Even though you see it, even though this is your idea, it's also an adjustment from you because communicating with men is a thing. It's like a whole entire thing. And it's like I'm not quite sure what I'm seeing about this, but it looks like the way that you communicate with your partner doesn't trigger this issue for you that most men do trigger for you.

Erika: Mm-hmm.

Jessica: Do you know who the⁠—I believe she's called the hugging saint, Amma.

Erika: Amma. Yeah. I went to see her.

Jessica: Okay. She's magic, right?

Erika: Yeah.

Jessica: There's this quote that I⁠—I'm really bad at quoting things properly, but she has this quote that I'm going to generalize. It's something to the effect of her love is like a river, and you can spit in the river and you can throw trash in the river, and the river flows just the same. It's this very spiritual concept around nonattachment. And I think it can get into being martyry, which I'm not a fan of and I don't want to encourage you towards in any way, shape, or form. But there is a process of nonattachment that I think that you are going to have to be engaged in because of this Neptune transit and also because of the Pluto transit.

And that will show up both in your relationship to time management, to self-care, but also to how you relate to the people you are forming coalitions with because some of these coalitions will go really well, and some of them will not because⁠⁠—obviously. But also, I'm looking at your chart. It will not. And so it's about recognizing when it's time to cut bait, to let people go or let an effort go because, again, you can be so brave and strong-willed that it can be hard for you to be like, "You know what? They keep on throwing trash in my river. Three times, I was open. I was willing to work with them, just see if they're evolving. Fourth time, no. They're out of the forest." I don't know. I'm mixing metaphors, but you get where I'm going with this.

Erika: I get where you're going. I got it.

Jessica: Thank you. So this looks like it's going to be really important, and again, it's like I think in general you're actually quite good at this, but these transits are fucking with you, and so the stakes are so high that I think it makes it so much harder.

Erika: Right. And I will tell you, because as a Black woman, first of all, who's been in love with Black women my whole entire life, it's only [redacted] that has departed from⁠—so that's a huge thing, and I actually kept it secret from the people in my movement and my organization because the white man is the enemy. So there's that, and then with Black women being able to help them move from their anger and rage at white women and at the system and white oppression and all those things being very real, but because I've done my work and I'm now on a different bus⁠—I know we're all going to get there. Some of us are on the 6:00 a.m., some of us are on the 12:00, and some of us are on the 8:00 p.m. And so I know that I'm going to be having to deliver a message that let's just say might not be the funnest message for my people to hear.

Jessica: Yeah. That's real, and that's complicated. It's real and it's complicated on the level of it being what you're talking about in your personal life, and also how wild⁠— life is so bonkers.

Erika: Yeah.

Jessica: And also, it's really complicated in terms of your public life. Right?

Erika: Right.

Jessica: And in terms of coalition-building and movement-building, it is complicated. This is where⁠—thank goodness that you're a fully developed adult, because you have a self-esteem and a sense of self that is already established. That said, no one is not fragile to especially your peers talking shit. And again, the transits you're going through include a Pluto square to the Moon. And I've never heard of anyone going through that transit not having their feelings hurt. So it's a thing, and it just is a process. And it's about not attaching, not allowing people to have power over your sense of self, because this process that you're committed to is so important to you and to the world.

Erika: And I keep saying to people that we've already benefited from the privilege of Roe v. Wade. I've already been able to have my two abortions. The work that we must do now is for children and people that aren't even born yet and that we have to understand that we are playing the long game and not be invested in my rights. Of course, I understand the importance of that, but this is not that fight. It is a longer-rage fight. And so I also understand sustainability and nonattachment because it's not really about me anymore.

Jessica: Yeah. That's right. And I wish⁠—I mean, I'm so glad we don't have the Supreme Court decision yet. I mean, every day that it doesn't exist is kind of a good day. And also, if we had it, I could pull up a chart for it, and I could read for it. So don't you worry; I will pay attention to when that gets decreed when it does, and we can talk about it later if that's helpful. But I will say that in February of this year, it was the end of a two-year process, a two-year transit to the Roe v. Wade chart. Neptune was opposing Roe v. Wade's Moon, and it was doing it from the twelfth house.

So, in English, what this means⁠—for the last two years, religious⁠—I would say religious zealots; I would say people who have really deep religious convictions⁠—have been behind the scenes, twelfth house, working to change both the laws around Roe v. Wade, basically setting the stage, and also the hearts of so many people in their religious communities. That has been happening for the last two years. That transit ended in late February 2022. But in that period, we had these conservative justices added, and we've seen a lot from religious right conservatives happening in these past couple of years.

And the reason why I name this is because so much of what we are dealing with on the surface of Roe v. Wade right now, it's already been done. The foundations have already been set behind the scenes. And Neptune will cross the Ascendant of the Roe v. Wade chart in 2025. So, again, we're looking at this 2024/2025. It makes me think that this will not go quietly into the night, first of all. I mean, obviously not if you have anything to say about it. But also, I don't see this going away. I don't see this going away, and I don't know what that means because if they over⁠—and perhaps you can educate me. If they overturn Roe v. Wade, does that mean we will never return to it? Is that how it works?

Erika: I think, from what I understand, is that Roe v. Wade is dead, and we can't return to it and we shouldn't return to it because it didn't actually serve everyone the way we know it now needs to because consciousness has changed. We know more. And so we have to create a different thing, but no one knows what that different thing can even look like yet.

Jessica: Yeah. That's right. And it is important to name that the basis that they're trying to overturn Roe v. Wade on is around privacy, and what a slippery slope that is and how many rights that we take for granted in the United States are about to be violently stripped away. It's interesting because if the chart becomes dead next week, then part of me feels like, well, then, this chart doesn't make⁠—it's not active. But the truth is it is active in American consciousness. It is active in our lives in a really material way.

Erika: I often say we try to⁠—what we're doing, our generation, is that we are in the gap. We are hospicing Roe v. Wade as we are also midwives for what is next. And so that's a very precarious place as you watch something you love die and also watch something you don't know is going to exist and sort of shepherd it in. So that's a very precarious place for us, and we will be in the void. And void is always scary to everyone.

Jessica: Yeah. Yeah. That's really, really well said. I'm grateful you're a minister because that was beautiful. So there's two things that are scratching my brain right now. One is I want to ask you⁠—point me in more directions of how I can be helpful if there's more that I can be helpful with. And then the other thing is just this Pluto conjunction to Mercury⁠—it's just like my brain is not letting it go because it is about storytelling. It is about having difficult conversations. And it's also about the essential dignity of people having body autonomy, which is something that is being challenged by republicans in every possible way that doesn't directly impact cis white men, obviously. Right?

Erika: Right.

Jessica: This Mercury placement is the same place as Pluto in the United States' chart, like "birth chart." So the Pluto Return that we talk about so much is at the same⁠—it's 27 degrees. It's 28 degrees of Cap. So this is directly related to the revolutionary times that we're in within the United States and how the powers that be want to revert back to the horrors of the founding fathers. This means that this is a very legal battle, and I think that's maybe super obvious that it's a very legal battle; we're talking about Roe v. Wade. But as I look at this chart, I'm just like⁠—when you think about coalition-building or when you talk about having these conversations, we need a lot of lawyers⁠—scholars, yes, but lawyers⁠—in the fight in every state. And I don't know if that's helpful or if that's stupid and obvious, but it just really stands out here.

Erika: Well, I mean, I think that it is that we are going to need lots of lawyers that know the legalities and can work within the system, but they have to be able to work within the system in a way where they're carrying both that piece and the piece of deep revolutionary listening and communication skills in a way that hasn't been displayed by the movement, with no shade to the lawyers that have done incredible work so far, but thinking about it differently and being able to think about it differently but work within the system the way the system is set up. And so that's going to require incredible complex understandings, that marriage between the mind and the heart. So we need lawyers that are⁠—my word often is in their wholeness⁠—in order to craft what is new. So it's going to be interesting.

Jessica: It's like a unicorn. It's like a horse with a horn on it, maybe, but it's hard to find is what I'm trying to say.

Erika: Well, because the lawyers that are going to do this aren't lawyers yet.

Jessica: That's exactly what I was thinking when you were saying that. You're talking about these younger generations, right?

Erika: Right.

Jessica: That have a more radical approach. It's exactly what I think the GOP is trying to desperately stop is this generation of young people who want to do different⁠⁠—want to do better, want to do different. And this is the fucked-up thing. Pluto is such a dick. There's no other way to put it. Or I guess I could say Pluto is a shit. Pluto is messy and powerful and punishing, and it's also the planet that governs reparations. And having something better than Roe v. Wade is so important. It's so important. I just, again, at the risk of saying the obvious, want to say this is not a straight path forward. There's just no way with this chart. There's just no way with this astrology. It's going to be a winding path that sometimes seems like it's completely going in the wrong direction, and you know what? It may end up in the wrong direction. For sure, bad things happen all the time.

But if things are going in a bad direction, it is easy as activists to become demoralized⁠—or not as activists, as people looking at our rights being stripped, to become demoralized. It is demoralizing. But this is how Pluto works. It brings us to this dark night of the soul [crosstalk]⁠—

Erika: Right, and that's the thing. Crisis brings transformation.

Jessica: Yes.

Erika: And so we have to do that what I like to call⁠—Pluto does that holy shakedown, and you're reconstructed from the inside out. But first there has to be the destruction, and nobody really likes that part.

Jessica: I don't. It's awful. It's terrible and it's scary.

Erika: Well, I'm kind of into it because I know as soon as it starts happening, that's where true transformation⁠—I have been saying we've got to kill Roe and kill it quickly. But what's painful is that it's been in the ICU unit, and so we're watching it die. And it's like it would almost be better to have it murdered so that we can move on, but watching it die is very painful. That death and that destruction is very painful to watch, and none of us likes to watch it or let alone be in it. But I understand that that's the only way in which we are going to give birth to something new. There's no other way.

Jessica: Yeah. You know what? I think you're 100 percent right. And it's a really bitter pill to swallow. It just really is. And I guess, yeah, that brings me to the other part of my question is, is there anything else that I could be helpful around, any kind of questions about you personally?

Erika: I did. I had one question. It looks like there's either⁠—the thing I'm doing with my strategic planning firm is just in its baby stage, but there's also this issue around making a living and needing to do that, and there could be work that I could do in the movement in a traditional way. And I'm not sure which is the way I should do it and which path should I take, or just guiding, which would be the most beneficial both to me financially and to the movement?

Jessica: Great.

Erika: I'm not quite sure.

Jessica: And this is primarily around money, right? Like around how to support yourself through the work?

Erika: Yeah, and what is actually the most impactful as well.

Jessica: Okay. So will you say the name of your firm?

Erika: Envision Justice.

Jessica: Great. It's top-heavy.

Erika: Well, the other thing underneath that is another sub work that I'm doing called Power Post-Roe. And the idea is to help people step into being empowered post-Roe, that death is not the end; it's actually the beginning.

Jessica: I see. That has a really strong energy to it, and it looks like Power Post-Roe is something that you could partner with other orgs around. It just looks like it's very⁠—it's got a lot of sparkle. It's very mobile.

Erika: Yeah. It is.

Jessica: And it's a great branch and articulation of your vision here.

Erika: The purpose of that is to help individuals do their inner work so that they can do the work on what happens post-Roe. And it's designed to help people who are already working in reproductive justice movement to be fully healed so that they can sustain the work. So it's more diffusive, and the design is to help people do their inner work so they can sustain the work externally.

Jessica: That's so powerful. Will you share the name of the web address, and I'll put it in the show notes as well?

Erika: Oh. Sure.

Jessica: How can people find it?

Erika: The website is reproductivejusticepostroe.com.

Jessica: Okay. Great. So we're going to make sure that people can go and support the work.

Erika: Yeah. So they can just sign up. Yeah.

Jessica: Great. They can use the work. They can support the work. They can share the work.

Erika: Yeah.

Jessica: Great. That doesn't exactly make money, or does it? I can't tell.

Erika: Well, I mean, it should technically, because I'm going to be providing lots of courses and classes and all kinds of things to help bring people along from whatever trauma and pain they have post-Roe. So it should. And then the other work, Envision Justice, is designed for orgs. It's something to help them design a different part of the movement.

Jessica: It's a higher level.

Erika: Yeah.

Jessica: It's like big-picture thinking, that kind of stuff, is what I'm seeing.

Erika: Right. Right. Right.

Jessica: And that looks like it's going to be slower to take off because it's dragging people to do the work. Right?

Erika: Right. Right. Right.

Jessica: Which⁠—I think people are really overwhelmed and burned out and all of the things. So, first of all, I've clarified which of these two pieces I see making a little more money in the short term and kind of garnering more excitement in general in the short term. But then, in terms of⁠—like do you need other consulting gigs on the side is the question, right?

Erika: Yeah. I mean, or should I just go into an organization and work⁠—a repro organization, a traditional job in the reproductive justice movement, which is a regular job.

Jessica: I have such an annoying answer for you. I don't think it's a good idea to go back into those jobs. I just think you're done. I think you have had those power struggles before. You know what's going to happen. And it's kind of a waste of your energy.

Erika: Yeah. I'm afraid I'll get bogged down in emails and slack.

Jessica: It's exactly what I'm saying, is you'll get bogged down in process. That's really what it looks like. And you know what? That work is important. I'm not shitting on that work. It's just you've got this fire under your ass and in your belly to do something different. You figured it out. I mean, it's not 100 percent perfect, but again, you figured it out and it would feel like going back. It wouldn't feel like going forward. So I hate to say that to you because if you're going to have to get a side hustle, it makes sense for it to be still connected to what you are passionate about.

But I just⁠—I attribute this to the Uranus conjunction to your Saturn. I don't think you can go back. I don't think you can go back to the corporate world in the way you have. I don't think you can go back to these organizations in the way you have before. And it makes me wonder⁠—because you do consulting, right?

Erika: Mm-hmm.

Jessica: With powerful people, or just with organizations?

Erika: Well, not powerful people, so to speak, but definitely with organizations. That's the idea.

Jessica: Yeah. I'll just tell you what's coming up, and you'll play with it. But I do think it's worth considering the consulting as something that could go to powerful people and not just organizations because in a way, you can make more of an impact consulting with somebody who they themself has a great deal of power in any interpretation of that. You're very impactful one-on-one. I mean, you're impactful on all the levels. I'm not going to take any of the levels from you. But you are really impactful one-on-one, and I think it might be a good use of your energy and it's also different enough from what you've done to satisfy Uranus, who is trying to get you to do things differently.

I actually think it's a bit of a lighter lift for you than going into all this process and organizational stuff. So that is standing out to me, and this is something where I would simply say to you, if you sit with it and it ends up feeling like a yes, manifest it. Yeah, put feelers out; that's part of manifesting. But I don't think you need to reinvent the wheel about it. I think that there are people who are running companies and organizations, people who have a lot of money, who would actually really want to be able to consult with you. It's just a question of⁠—bear with me. Fuck. So this thing keeps on coming up. Let me just tell you what keeps on coming up.

You're impatient, right? I said that earlier, but you didn't really seem yes or no. Are you impatient?

Erika: I've cultivated a level of patience, but certainly, it's not my strong suit.

Jessica: You've got a lot of fire in you. And you're an Aquarius, so you come by it honestly. I keep on seeing you hitting a wall. I keep on seeing you hitting a wall and being like, "Fuck. This is too hard. No. I can't do this." And I don't know if that wall is external⁠—it's something happening to the world, or you try to make anything happen and within two months, it doesn't happen⁠—or you have a health event and it kind of stops your progress. It could be anything. But what I'm seeing is that that wall may really distract you and demoralize you so that you take it as a wall made of stone. And I don't see it being a wall made of stone. I see it as another reminder or reinforcement that you need a new and different kind of self-regulation.

And sometimes what's going to happen is that your circumstances stop you so that you have to do that. I kind of think that's what you're going through right now because you're like⁠— all cylinders on, full speed ahead. You're just like, "It's fucking go time. Let's go." And as a person in this country, I thank you. But as an astrologer, I gotta say this isn't sustainable. This is what the Universe is going to do. So what I'm being shown is two things, and then we'll come back to your question. The first is notice when you start to feel blocked or frustrated⁠—try to notice it, and consciously work with it, either using your pre-existing tools or innovating.

And then the other thing is pick your battles wisely. That's going to be the magic thing for you here. There are some battles that are absolutely worthy of your energy, and there are some that aren't. And your energy is something you have to prioritize in this period more than is your comfort zone.

Erika: Okay.

Jessica: And you said at the beginning, "Oh, I do way too much." And I want to say I don't agree with that. You described a lot, but I think whether that means it needs to shift a little and be a little less structured, whether that means you do it because you need it—keep going; you need more⁠—either one, at the end of the day, you're really putting yourself up against some fucking heavy hitters. And this is deep. That said, coming back to your question around money⁠—I hate to say this. Corporate consulting looks good.

Erika: Yeah. Yeah.

Jessica: Not going into a corporation, but corporate consulting pays well. It's less of an energy and time commitment, and it sharpens your skills for building this organization that you're building, which⁠—

Erika: Right. Well, it tracks because we were talking about a lot of organizations like Amazon. A lot of organizations are trying to figure out how they can help post-Roe and where they can put their money to help post-Roe. And that's what I think I can do well. I can help people figure out how to do that.

Jessica: Yes. 100 percent. That's the direction to go in. I think that's where you can make an impact, also make money. It's also a data-collecting mission. It's like crossing⁠—I'm not going to call them enemy lines, but you're crossing lines, we'll say, to figure out how they're thinking. You're getting more important information about the gap between what they say and what they feel or what they do. It's ironic that that looks like it will support your work more than working in the industry actually will.

Erika: Right. It's interesting. And what you said is what [redacted] said. He's like, "I think you could do this, and I can help you. This is where white man is going to come be useful because I understand how they think, and I can guide and direct you." And he already did that once before with my previous work, and he was excellent at it. I'm like, "I should just hire you out, like White Man Consulting, like how to speak white man." I don't know. We were joking, of course. But I'm just saying⁠—yeah. So it tracks with what we've been talking about.

Jessica: Good. I'm glad to hear that, and I do see him being, actually, a pretty important part of this, of your organization. I think that he's down to do the work, and also, his brain is just so good for operations and planning. It's so consistent. He remembers the details while tracking the big picture. Very⁠—

Erika: Yes. That's him.

Jessica: ⁠—I mean, a great person to have on your team.

Erika: Yeah.

Jessica: And he's not offensive. He doesn't assert in a way that pushes people away or down, which is⁠—it's not nothing.

Erika: Yeah. It is what you described. So this is very helpful.

Jessica: I think you're going to be good. I think that you're ready. I think that you've been ready for this work. Some of this is about marketing and PR, and it is worth considering whether or not⁠—if you haven't already hired somebody to do that kind of work, whether or not it's wise to because much like your partner is able to dispassionately see what you're so passionate about and get in there in the crevices, marketing and/or PR people can do something similar, good ones. So, if anyone is listening and wants to donate their time and skills, just reach out.

When I look at your business energetically, that looks like a weak part in the foundation. That makes sense, yeah?

Erika: Yeah.

Jessica: And that part's important if you're selling to consult to corporations and big boys and all that kind of crap.

Erika: Right. Gotcha. It all makes sense.

Jessica: Yeah. Yeah. Now, before we're done, do you have multiple websites or just the one you shared?

Erika: I actually have two. One is the reproductivejusticepostroe.com, and then Envision Justice, because one is consulting and one is the sort of general public.

Jessica: Great. So, if people want to reach out to you, support the work, get involved, they can go to either of these places.

Erika: Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely.

Jessica: Great. And once⁠—I still am saying "if," even though I know. I know. But once and if Roe is overturned, let's all keep track of the time. We will cast a chart. We will meet again.

Erika: Fantastic. Fantastic. This has been extraordinary, absolutely extraordinary.

Jessica: Yay. Thank you. You are a total joy, and I'm so grateful for your work. Thank you. And I guess I have one last question for you, which is⁠—you're a minister. Is there a place where you offer spiritual services that people can find you?

Erika: Well, I used to have a church, but once I started working in this work, I left doing that. And I actually⁠—my spiritual counseling work is focused on women⁠—people, families⁠—and their reproductive health choices, so to help shepherd them through whatever part of their life they might need that support in. So it's solely on that.

Jessica: That's beautiful. And is there a particular denomination that you are?

Erika: I'm a licensed interfaith minister. My master is in world religions.

Jessica: Beautiful. Great. Again, for anyone listening, reach out to Erika and benefit from her work. And also spread the goodness of the work. Thank you so much. This has been such a joy. Again, I do thank you so much for your work. It's so important. Yeah. You're great. I thank you so much.

Erika: Thanks. Thanks so much, Jessica. This has been fantastic, such a joy.

Supporting local abortion funds that help arrange and pay for abortion care for patients who need it is one of the most impactful actions you can take for reproductive justice today. Planned Parenthood is great, of course, but also consider donating to the Yellowhammer Fund, Mississippi Reproductive Freedom Fund, and Margins: Women Helping Black Women. The links for all three of these orgs are in show notes. If you or someone you know is a pilot, you can consider becoming a volunteer with elevatedaccess.org to help transport passengers at no cost to them to access gender-affirming and abortion healthcare. And finally, the Church of Prismatic Light is a religion for LGBTQIA+ people and allies who want religious freedom to have the right to bodily autonomy, marry who they love, transition, and have gender-affirming care. You can find them at prismaticlightchurch.org.

Erika: Okay. Here we are.

Jessica: I mean, it's so good to see you again, but I really wish this was not the reason⁠—not even 24 hours later.

Erika: Not even 24 hours later. And it's so bizarre because the movement has been planning⁠—we knew the decision was going to come down, but they don't usually issue decisions on Friday.

Jessica: It's so devastating, and it's like I feel bad to bring you back because it's such a⁠—we're talking in such an emotional moment. It's been a couple hours.

Erika: I can't even imagine. I'm trying to put together⁠—I mean, we were supposed to do this whole big⁠—the church in Dallas is the home of Roe v. Wade because Roe went to the Unitarian Universalist Church in Dallas. And so I was part of a clergy contingent that we were going to be hosting an event the night of the decision. None of us is in Dallas. We are all everywhere. So it was going to be a huge service livestreamed to UUs all over the country because we wanted to offer a place for lament and for people to come who needed someplace that wasn't marching but needed someplace to hold the space to be. And so just the amount of insanity that's happened in the last couple hours…

Jessica: I mean⁠—and I'm sure whenever you hold it, it will be appreciated. But it's just such a devastating passage. But we have this chart to pull.

Erika: Yeah.

Jessica: I got the time for 10:05 a.m. is when they landed the decision. Is that the time you have as well?

Erika: That's the time I have. I was just sitting trying to decide what I was going to do with my day before it was decided for me. And yeah, that's the time I have.

Jessica: Great. Okay. Good, because I mean, I've kind of tried to cross-check it on the internet. You know, it's a wild forest out there, so nobody knows. But 10:05 a.m., June 24th, 2022, in Washington, D.C. I am tempted to have a very emotional conversation where we just cuss a lot, but I feel like there's⁠—

Erika: It might be helpful to actually say something besides, "What the actual fuck?"

Jessica: Yeah. What the actual fuck? Let's talk about lots of things because I wanted to share with you what I see in this chart, and I think it's important to contextualize all this is is the punch in the face to Roe. This is the end of Roe. And so this chart is an event chart, but it's like it's a complicated thing because when we look at something like Roe v. Wade, we are looking at the life of Roe v. Wade. What we're looking here is at the death of Roe v. Wade, which is⁠—and it's an activist's tool, but it's not⁠—something is going to come next, and we shall see. Right?

Erika: Right.

Jessica: So the first thing that stands out to me is that there is this Saturn conjunct the Descendant very tightly forming a square to the Midheaven and North Node. What this means is it is a restrictive, punitive, patriarchal decision. And it's meant to be rigid, and it is. Job well done.

Erika: Right. Good job doing that thing.

Jessica: Yeah. Did a great job. On top of that⁠—and this is the thing that I think is very important to note⁠—this stellium at the top of this event chart, we have a Moon/Uranus/North Node/Midheaven in Taurus, and they're all sitting on top of each other. What this indicates⁠—and I've been sitting with this chart, being like, "Just don't be mad. Read the chart, Jessica," which is hard when you're in the emotion. Right?

Erika: Right. Isn't it? Right.

Jessica: But the thing that I think is really important here is the human rights violation that this is. That's a tool for mobilization because Taurus is a zodiac sign to do, actually, with women, but it's also to do with who we value and what we value. It's about our material safety, security, and our rights in that regard. And when we're dealing with the planet Uranus in Taurus, we are dealing with human rights, civil liberties. And so it's not just about the domestic implications of this. It's the global implications of this. I believe the human rights⁠—there's a Human Rights Watch that's global.

Erika: Yeah.

Jessica: And what this articulates, not just to the people of the United States but to the world, is very dramatic. And this is a place where we can mobilize and organize. Does that make sense with⁠—

Erika: Right. It makes absolute sense because I'm⁠—again, in the repro justice world, what we're going to have to do now that the playing field has been leveled is that's the foundation which we're going to build on. We're going to look at this and move based on, what does it mean to be human?

Jessica: Yes. That's it. Okay. So, from this chart, I will say that's an effective strategy. That's an effective strategy because the whole world is looking at this and understands exactly what it is because even the United States has gone after other countries for not having access to reproductive care and body autonomy. So this is really important. Something else that I find really⁠—so there's two other things really interesting about this chart. One is the Pluto square to Mars. So, as you and I were talking about yesterday, the Pluto Return is active right now, which means the overturning of Roe v. Wade is a part of the United States' Pluto Return. This is a part of this returning to the founding fathers' time, which of course was a racist, misogynist, homophobic, etc., etc. time.

So the Pluto square to Mars is an indication of violence, and it's an indication of violence from men, unfortunately. And it's not just men who are against abortion. I think that's important. And there's a woman on the Supreme Court who is instrumental in making this happen. But we're talking about the patriarchy, really. The Mars/Pluto square does indicate the risk for physical violence in response to this decision. And I don't know that that's a bad thing or a good thing. I'm not an advocate or fan of violence, but it is what it is. That's what the chart articulates. Again, it's going to change on a global stage.

All of the violence we perpetrate, it's going to further shift our presence globally in that way. We can go into other countries and we can tell them what they're doing wrong with arms, but then we do such terrible things to our populace. And so there is, again, an organizing/mobilizing tool that we can use within that to fight. Does that make sense to you?

Erika: It does. And there's two things that I want to bring up around this particular thing you're talking about, and that is in Washington, D.C.⁠—and I've traveled all over the country the last couple of weeks⁠—there are posters everywhere calling for rioting and violence in resistance to the Roe v. Wade decision.

Jessica: Interesting. Interesting.

Erika: Everywhere. I've never seen anything like this before. So those were⁠—I mean, I took pictures. Those posters are everywhere. And the second thing that comes to mind is the importance of us as a reproductive justice movement reaching out globally to help galvanize other countries and people in other countries to help us mobilize, to bring attention to the fact that in our country, the United States, we are experiencing the inhumanity.

Jessica: Yes. Yes. Yes. And I have a question. When you saw all those signs, did you have a sense of who was putting them up, like what organization? Was it actually a reproductive rights organization?

Erika: They're actually listed as a terrorist group of reproductive rights advocates, not named, but it is an actual underground group that is calling for violence in the streets.

Jessica: Okay. So it's not like the Proud Boys stirring shit. It's not that. It's an actual group as far as we know.

Erika: As far as we know. So I don't know.

Jessica: The thing that is really concerning and interesting around that, in the context of the Pluto Return of all of this violent and⁠—kind of like we're just in⁠—everything is on the verge of catching fire and spreading. It would be very easy for hate groups who are anti-choice to use this as a way to create chaos and violence and all of that. This is something for everyone who's going to hit the streets to be mindful of, right?

Erika: Right.

Jessica: It's sticky. Do you have any thoughts on that further before I move to the next thing?

Erika: A couple of thoughts. As we're looking at the chart, when I think of the divine feminine⁠—part of what I understand, the divine feminine energy is the bringer of chaos, creativity, and also, the fact that it makes sense to me that if there is going to be destruction, I understand that it has⁠—even though it's inflicted on women, I also understand that it is women that have to bring some level of chaos in order to reconstruct what's happening. And that's the sort of shadow part of the divine feminine that I think has, also, a place here.

Jessica: Yeah. I agree completely. And to back it up with more astrology, Uranus is in Taurus. The last time we had this transit, it was World War II. Not to invoke that, but it is real. And part of what happened during the war is women had more rights, could work. And so there's this reiteration. Uranus is related to chaos and instability and also revolution. And it's very hard to have a revolution without tearing shit down, and it is messy. I mean it is messy.

And then this actually brings me to the last piece of this chart that I think is really important to name, which is we have this Jupiter in the eighth house. And the eighth house is one of the places we look to for sex, which⁠—some sex is procreative and can get a person pregnant. And the other place we look is the fifth house. Now, in this chart⁠—I use Campanus houses⁠—we have Jupiter as the zodiac sign on the house cusp of the fifth. So the ruling planet, the planet we look to to see the fifth house of this chart, is Jupiter.

So Jupiter is a big deal in this chart, it's worth noting. And Jupiter is in Aries forming a square to the Sun in Cancer, the place of the mother. And so another organizing/mobilizing approach is that it is people who are mothers, who've had children, that often have abortions or have need for this form of care. I mean, it's so obvious to say, but that we are placing the needs of a potential mother or parent, a birthing parent, at the bottom of the food chain of what's important. And again, this is around humanity.

But the problem with Jupiter square to the Sun in the context of this chart is that it's impulsive. So, on the one hand, impulsiveness is good because it empowers us to take risks and to be bold. But on the other hand, it may signify a bit of a⁠ "too many cooks in the kitchen" kind of messaging because you and I were talking about storytelling being so important yesterday. And so today, when I look at this chart, I'm like, "Oh, the story may get diluted because there's so much with it." And so I don't really have an answer for that. I'm curious if you have any thoughts about that. But that is part of what comes up for me because I look at this square, and it's the one part of the chart where I'm just like⁠—I'm tempted to give really negative and really positive interpretations. In other words, it's messy. It's spontaneous big all over the place.

Erika: Right. Well, I have a thought about that. And when I say masculine, I understand that we all have both masculine and feminine equally. That's fine. So, when I'm talking about⁠—what I understand the masculine energy to be is the bringer of order. So there has to be an overlay within the chaos where we bring our divine masculine, all of us, to bring order, to bring things in to be more focused. And so we're going to have to tap into that. All of us are going to have to bring in and tap into this divine order that is part of the masculine role. And I don't know how we're going to be able to do that, but I do have an understanding that it's going to have to play a significant place in creating direction.

Jessica: Yeah. And that might simply be around organizing. I mean, I have to say⁠—and this is kind of like a dire thing to say, and this is an event chart, not a human's chart, not a birth chart. But Jupiter in the eighth can be associated with death because Jupiter is related to expansion. And what is death if not the great expansion? And so having Jupiter in Aries, which is the zodiac sign associated with maleness and associated with knives and combat, forming a square to the Sun in Cancer from the eighth house⁠—I mean, it's also to do, unfortunately, potentially with spontaneous death. Jupiter is not drawn out, usually. It's rapid.

So there is, I guess, two things I'm getting at here. One is around health, just the health of people who need abortion care. And I think the other is around having really strong storylines, several strong storylines that are kind of streamlined⁠— many strong storylines, but that are somehow streamlined so that there is still unity within the myriad of stories. That's going to be really important, and that's hard to achieve in any movement when it's really emotional. And this is really emotional.

Erika: Right. And I think we're going to have to be able to talk about the death that is going to happen as a result of this. And our country has a weird dynamic with death. And so we're going to have to⁠—I mean, the reality is there has not been in recorded history, or ever, revolution without death. And that means also physical death. And so the reality is that some of us will have to die in order for new life to take place. And when a mother gives birth, there is a part of her that really⁠—there is a death and giving over of who she used to be in order to become.

And so we're going to have to turn and look at this squarely in the face, streamline the storylines by saying, "My humanity, my right to live, supersedes your desire for something else for me." And we'll have to all be able to say that within the context of our own stories.

Jessica: Yeah. Yeah. That's exactly right. And again, just to reiterate⁠—and again, thank you so much for joining me to just follow up this conversation⁠—but is that this is the chart that you and I are discussing of the overturning of Roe, and there will have to be new charts because it's not just about overturning Roe; it's about how we organize, what we do in response. I think that this is hopefully important for people who are activists or wanting to get into activism to make a difference because this isn't going to go away. This is a part of the Pluto Return. This isn't going to go away. This is a part of the Uranus in Taurus cycle. It just isn't going to go away because they overturned a person's right to choose what to do with their body.

Erika: Can you speak just briefly with this chart to what I understand my ancestors to⁠—the shoulders I stand on is this idea that no matter what decision that is handed down, it cannot stop my destiny and us in our humanity being able to⁠—that we have the power, regardless of the obstacles we face. And is there any way to see that in this chart? Where is the most resilience for us?

Jessica: Yeah. That's great. That's a great question, and it's not a Capricorn question. So I appreciate it. You're keeping me in that Sadge good vibes, and I need help with that. So thank you. So I'll give a caveat, and then I'll give the answer. The caveat is this is the chart of the overturning, so yes, there is some of that. But it's like this is the chart of a punch in the face. So it's not the most inspiring chart, even though I'm going to extrapolate, just to be fair. So it's actually the stellium in Taurus at the top of the chart⁠—it is the Moon conjunct Uranus conjunct the Midheaven conjunct the North Node, all in Taurus.

What this speaks to is it speaks to women and people of other genders, and the reason why I say other genders is because Uranus brings in a nonbinary⁠—it is inclusive. So it can be inclusive to cis men, but it is not explicitly about cis men. It's about everyone else. It is us coming together based on our shared values, and it is about us doing things for ourselves. So I imagine that the ability to manage and care for our reproductive health is going to be crowdsourced through the internet.

Now, this is something that I've been kind of talking about on the podcast a lot for a number of years, is my profound concerns about our safety online and the restrictions that will be imposed upon us or are being imposed upon us, the ways we're tracked online. But it is about being able to share ways of caring for our bodies. Taurus is an earth sign that is very much related to herbology and other ways that we can resource things that already exist, ways of caring for our bodies and our souls and our hearts as a collective. And this does refer to pulling from the past, from what already exists, but it is about something new moving forward because Uranus is involved.

So that is honestly the best answer I've got. But the other thing I can just add is that Jupiter/Sun square⁠—I do believe that we, our cause, will have global support. And that's also really powerful just on a spiritual level, tapping into that global support. Of course, there's going to be some oppressive people and places that are not supportive, but by and large, I do think we will have global support here. So does that kind of answer that?

Erika: Yep. That actually does, because it gives us some understanding that the underground that we're starting to dig into now is going to be the tunnel.

Jessica: Yes. Yeah. That's it. That's it.

Erika: Okay.

Jessica: And some of this, speaking to ancestors, it's like so many of our ancestors have dealt with this already. And so there is so much information out there. We need to coalesce and we need to bring it together. We need to do it safely online, and that's something that I think will be very challenging because we still are going through the Saturn/Uranus square. It's kind of out of orb still, but it's coming back in very, very shortly, I believe within a week. So this is where we really need to be part of organizing around reproductive freedoms. I think it's also about organizing, about internet safety, our online autonomy, because I think we will be vulnerable in that regard.

Erika: Yeah. Okay. Well, we're in it. We're in it now, and the timing could not have been⁠—you know⁠—

Jessica: I mean⁠—yeah.

Erika: ⁠—what it is, right?

Jessica: The timing is perfect/terrible/perfect.

Erika: Right. Right.

Jessica: I thank you so much for making the time this morning. I know you're so busy. Really appreciate it.

Erika: Sure. Okay. Great.

Jessica: And you are wonderful. Thank you so much for [crosstalk].

Erika: Thanks so much, Jessica. I appreciate you so much. Take care.

Jessica: I appreciate you. You, too. Bye.

Erika: Bye.

Okay. Here we damn are. We all know about the Pluto Return. Unless this is your first time listening to Ghost of a Podcast, you've heard me talk about this stuff a lot, especially recently as the heat is getting turned up in the U.S. And it's no surprise that we have seen the repeal of Roe. It's no surprise that we've see the repeal of Roe based on the right to privacy, but that doesn't mean it isn't horrifying and it is not really emotional for so many of us. Clarence Thomas has already said that he wants to come for contraception, gay sex⁠—yeah, sodomy⁠—and gay marriage next.

And it's very important to ask yourself, how in the world will they enforce laws around contraception and gay sex? Well, if you have been paying attention to what has been happening in the United States in recent months, it becomes pretty clear, right? And I will say if you are cisgendered and you have not been paying much attention to or caring much about the anti-Trans and anti-Queer bills that have been passed in 2022 by the republicans, it is time to really pay attention. There have been more of these bills passed now than in any other time in American history. And it is really important because Trans people, gender-queer people, and Queer people matter, period, full stop, period.

But it's also really important because when the government polices gender, when the government polices our bodies, it doesn't stop with Trans people or Gay people. It doesn't and it couldn't. It is so tightly woven with the rights of women. When the government is policing our bodies and what we consensually do behind closed doors, we are in a world of trouble. We're still in the beginnings of this Pluto Return in its exactitude. I see a lot of people saying we won't go back, and I like that slogan a lot. But the truth is, are we really going back? We can't really go back because going back to a pre-Roe v. Wade world⁠—we're talking about the '60s and the early 1970s and before that. We're talking about a time where there were no computers that are constantly tracking your behavior both online and in real life.

I don't think we're going back; I think we're going someplace new altogether. And you know that for years I've been talking on the podcast about the importance of a free press and the importance of online security and safety. And that has always been true, especially for marginalized people. But I want to say that now, in light of Roe being overturned and what really seems to be the criminalization of so many people's bodies⁠—more than half the population's bodies, right? I mean, they are fixing to criminalize abortions and even miscarriages. We have to be much more careful with our online behavior and to understand that your little pocket computer, your phone, which you may be listening to me on right now⁠—it is constantly tracking your physical location. So, if you go to a physical place like, I don't know, Planned Parenthood, you are being tracked.

And whatever app is tracking you, whatever technology is tracking you, that information can be sold. It can be bought by governments or individuals or corporations with all manner of intent. So it is important to be using a VPN and to be using something like Tor. And it's important to be aware of your own safety. If you're going to protests, maybe don't bring your phone with you. And certainly⁠—my dear God, certainly do not take and post photos of people's faces at protests. It's time to be diligent about our safety and to take care of each other. This is the time where we must take care of each other because it's not just about you, and it's not just about me.

Not having body autonomy means you are a second-class citizen. It means you don't have basic human rights, and this cannot stand. Again, it is the goddamn Pluto Return. This is going to be dramatic. It is dramatic, and it's going to be dramatic. This is a time of revolution. So I want to share a couple of things. The first thing is this is capitalism, baby. It's capitalism, and Pluto is in fucking Capricorn. And so there's a lot of ways that we can shop responsibly and make choices within capitalism that are truly radical, which is ultimately about how and where we spend our money, what we support, and also how we take care of each other, how we share our resources, how we access resources, how we come together as a community, local community as well as online community.

So you have power in capitalism through the money you spend, how you make money, how you spend money, all that kind of good stuff. And that's an important thing to be thinking about. If you want to yell at or thank your elected representatives, there's a woman named Jessica Craven who has this amazing, incredibly easy-to-use resource that you can access that basically⁠—she sends out an email, and she gives you what she calls five minutes of resistance assistance each weekday. And basically, she tells you how exactly to find your elected representative and exactly what to say. Just it's a simple, short script that you can call. And if you hate the phone but you want to make a difference, just call after hours and leave a message on voicemail. You can also use Resistbot and use these same scripts on Resistbot, and that is just a tool that you just text 50409. And that is a free service that allows you to text or email your elected representatives.

So there are ways if you want to work within the system, which I am a fan of. I am not a fan of doing that exclusively, but I do think that it is impactful to make noise that elected officials have to listen to. So these are some resources. And Jessica Craven's newsletter is called Chop Wood, Carry Water, which I just kind of find very down to earth and charming. So, anyways, you can check those resources out. I will pop them in show notes of this episode. To quote Jessica Craven, "Don't agonize; organize." I'm a fan of that. I mean, I'm a fan of agonizing. I am actually into leaning into the suffering and the pain of injustice, but also at a certain point taking that energy and transforming it into action. That is where we can make an impact.

Anyways, let's get astrological. So we're looking at the week of June 26th through July 2nd of 2022. And unsurprisingly, there's a lot going on, including but not limited to a New Moon, an intense and kind of hairy Pluto transit, and a very anxiety-producing Neptune transit. What could possibly go wrong? If you're interested in getting a jump on the transits before they happen, you can always join me over on Patreon, were on the first of every month I drop a month-ahead horoscope where I delineate all of the major transits in an hour-plus-long bonus episode that is just astrology. It's nice to have a jump, and I also throw in a little Sun sign horoscope at the end, which is kind of fun. It's kind of fun.

Okay. I digress. Let me tell you about the 27th. So, on the 27th, we've got two exact transits. One is a Mercury sextile to Chiron, and the other is a Mars sextile to Saturn. Now, both of these transits are happily sextiles, and sextiles are a 60-degree angle between two or more planets. And the vibe that sextiles bring⁠—it gives creative spark vibes. It's a nice dynamic little boop of energy between whatever planets. And what's interesting in both of these sextiles is that they are happening to these kind of heavy-handed, intense planets. I'm calling Chiron a planet. It's not a planet; it's an asteroid.

So Mercury sextile Chiron is good for being able to mentally⁠—Mercury⁠—cope with difficult or painful content⁠—Chiron. This is an opportunity for us to have those difficult conversations, read those scary articles, just generally come to greater understanding of things that are kind of painful to cope with or to sit with because Mercury is our mind, and it has a tendency to get scattered and all over the place when it is uncomfortable. It goes through a restlessness or kind of a checkout place when it's really uncomfortable. But this sextile to Chiron is a great facilitator. And so, if you've been overwhelmed by the news and kind of avoiding it, this transit, exact on the 27th, is actually a really great time to dip your toe back into this little collective reality.

Now, on the same day, we have another sextile between Mars and Saturn. These two planets⁠—when they play nicely as they are doing on the 27th, it is really great because we can get things done that need to get done. We can set aside our ego and play nicely with others. This transit can facilitate greater humility and basically a willingness to do the work without needing it to be perfect or needing validation from circumstances or others. Mars sextile to Saturn, similar to the Mercury sextile to Chiron, is great for confronting hard things. Mars is about bravery and getting it done, and Saturn is about dealing with power structures. It's about dealing with your ambitions. It's about reality.

And so this start to the week⁠—we're going to be feeling it before the 27th and after, but this start to the week is really great for coping with reality, even⁠—nay, especially⁠—difficult realities. So that's really nice. It's going to be kind of in the background of the first half of this week, and we will still be feeling the effects of these two transits on the 28th, when we have three more transits to talk about. We have an exact Venus sextile to Jupiter, an exact Sun square to Jupiter, and a New Moon in Cancer.

On the 28th, the New Moon in Cancer, which means the Sun/Moon conjunction⁠—it will be exactly at seven degrees Cancer and 22 minutes at 7:52 p.m. Pacific Time. So, broadly speaking, New Moons are a great time for planting seeds, for coming to clarity, to initiate something, or in some way begin anew. And Cancer is, of course, the zodiac sign ruled by the Moon. And so, when we have this once-a-year event of a New Moon in Cancer, it is super emotional. And interestingly, Cancer is the mother of the zodiac. And for me personally, mom and dad, I know that they are very much conventionally gender roles, but they don't have to be regarded that way⁠—dad is man; mom is woman. I think that there are lots of really wonderful moms who happen to be cis men or Trans men. I think there are great dads who are femmes or cis women.

Anyways, all that said, yeah, Cancer is related to mothering. So here we are. Here we fucking are. And what we know about this New Moon in Cancer, themes of how you nurture or care for yourself, how safe or loved or loving you feel in your life, your relationship to home and your relationship to your physical dwelling, which may be the same thing for you and may not⁠—these things are all likely to be stimulated within a Cancer New Moon. Familial relationships may be really important. Certainly, heartfelt relationships are going to be really important this New Moon. And let me give you a little bit more information about why that is. That, my friends, is because of Jupiter.

So Jupiter is forming a square to the Sun and Moon in this chart, and this is a really big deal. It articulates to us that feelings are going to be big and spontaneous. So that might be big feelings of love. You may want to proclaim your love for someone or something. And it could be the opposite. It could kind of go either way is what I'm trying to say. What we are likely to feel is a lot, and when we feel a lot, there is a tendency that we have to get a little selfish, not because we are motivated by something negative but because we're consumed by our own felt experience. And when we're consumed by our own felt experience is often when we do the stupidest shit, not intentionally but simply because we're not reading the room. We're not considering the feelings of others.

And so it's really important during this transit to know that you're likely to be feeling easily activated, and so is everyone else. And because it's Jupiter, it's not a bad thing. However, we also have Mars/Pluto square, as I named. It's not exact in this chart, but it is very active. And so that intensifies all this activation. Mars/Pluto square, in the context of this chart, is very much about ego conflicts. So it would be very easy for me to link this to what is happening in the United States around Roe and kind of the struggle between men having full body autonomy and everyone else not, and the kind of violence that that is and how wrong that is going to sit or that is sitting with so many people. But to keep this more focused on us as individuals, our personal lives, this square indicates that power struggles are likely to emerge, that we are likely to feel defensive, paranoid, like someone's out to get you, that your coworker didn't ask you this question or spoke over you because they're trying to ruin your life. In other words, we tend to assume the worst under a Pluto/Mars square, and we tend to act in ways that are provocative. And that "action" can be leaky energy.

Again, Jupiter is spontaneous. And so Jupiter is spontaneous; Cancer is self-protective. And then you throw a Mars/Pluto square in the mix, and what you can have is fights, conflicts, passive aggressive or aggressive aggressive⁠—dealer's choice. Actually, you might not have a choice. It depends on who you're dealing with. And as always, you might not be affected by this terribly. None of this stuff may really hit anything particularly sensitive in your birth chart. But this is a global transit, which means you are going to be dealing with people who are being directly impacted by this transit, and you're going to have to deal with the energy one way or another, my friends. So watch out for your ego. Watch out for your entitlement. You are not better than anyone, and you are not worse than anyone. We all have the right to dignity. We all have the right to safety. We all have the right to our opinions. We don't have the right to all of our actions, but we have a right to all of our feelings and all of our opinions.

And it is really important that you, under this Full Moon, prioritize having healthy ways of experiencing and expressing your rage, your anger, your defensiveness, that you have healthy and sustainable ways of experiencing those things in your body and acting on them in your life. And there are a myriad of ways, and that's something I've talked about on many, many episodes of the podcast. I put the word "anger" in the search bar of my website and was just like, "Oh, I'm still scrolling. There's a lot of times I've mentioned this." But in particular, Episode 177 is "Anger & Forgiveness." That might be one for you to check out.

This is likely to feel pretty intense⁠—I'm not going to lie⁠—pretty intense. And happily, we also have an exact Venus sextile to Jupiter on the same day. And Venus sextile to Jupiter gives us a sense of resiliency. It makes it that much easier for us to act in ways that reflect our values. It makes it that much easier for us to be generous and kind with others and with ourselves. It also can make it easier for us to want everything to be nice and to gloss over unpleasantness, and that would be a misuse⁠—a really easy misuse, but a misuse⁠—of this energy.

A New Moon in Cancer on its own can be a moment when we come home to ourselves, when we realign with self-love, love of others, with care and empathy. It can be a beautiful moment in a year. But in the context of the broader world, in the context of the rest of this event chart of this New Moon, we know that it's not that simple or clean. We are all living through a global pandemic, and have you heard of monkeypox? I mean, polio is back in the UK. There's some crazy shit going on. There's some crazy shit going on separate from the evils that humans do, separate from the many forms of violence that we are living through, separate from the climate crisis. I mean, there's so much happening.

And yes, I know I'm a Capricorn. I can focus on the negative. I know that. But when we get really emotionally present, we cannot just get emotionally present for the lovely stuff. We must also acknowledge and stay present for the hard stuff, and that's the stuff that most of us don't have the willingness or the tools to deal with and to stay with. And when we develop those tools, when we cultivate a willingness to stay present with the hard stuff, we are stronger. We are stronger as individuals, and we are stronger as community members.

Lunations in general, but especially a New Moon in Cancer with this Jupiter activity and the Mars/Pluto square⁠—everything's going to feel personal. In some ways, everything is personal. But when things feel personal, we tend to act out a little more. We tend to be more defensive. And I want to just encourage you to be aware of that and to allow that awareness to be tempered by empathy and maybe even a little patience, just a little patience, because this is a big-deal transit at a big-deal time. Each individual transit that we are going through as individuals and as a collective⁠—all of these transits are occurring in the context of the larger transits that are happening. So everything is kind of tinged in a more challenging way right now. So, again, empathy, compassion, patience⁠—try them on for size. See how you do. And again, Jupiter is involved, and so there's a lot of positive potential for things to go well.

I would be remiss if I didn't say anything about COVID, though, because Jupiter⁠—Jupiter in Aries, as I talked about when Jupiter first moved into Aries, can be associated with spreading like wildfire. And Jupiter is like, "Eh, I won't be careful this time. I just want to have a good time." Yeah, you know, just put on the damn mask. You know what I mean? Just put on the damn mask. Somebody invented these little stickers that you put on your zits if you get maskne. You just wear them under your mask, and then problem solved. No? Am I the only one who has maskne? Okay. Whatever. Moving on.

That brings us to the 1st of July, and now we're getting into Canada Day celebrations, 4th of July celebrations, this nationalistic time here in North America. And of course, the zodiac sign of Cancer is associated with nationalism, so no big surprise that the 1st and 4th of July are highly nationalistic days. The astrology, my friends, just couldn't be worse. It couldn't be worse. I mean, it could. It could always be worse, but it's not great. I'll say that. The astrology is not great.

So, on the 1st, we have an exact Mars square to Pluto. I mentioned it in the context of the New Moon chart. We have been feeling it all week. Mars square to Pluto is violent. It is a violent transit, and there are so many ways that violence can play itself out. The way you talk to yourself is sometimes violent. Laws can be violent. And then there's good old-fashioned Mars: stab-stab, punch-punch, bang-bang. Violence. Pluto is systemic violence, and it is penetrating, collective-impacting violence. And unfortunately, Mars square Pluto is an explosive, big, scary transit in that regard.

Now, Mars square Pluto is not the first time this transit's happened. It's not an especially rare transit. So we should not expect that every person in the world is going to experience any kind of personal violence perpetrated to them, but certainly, if you feel unsafe, if you're in a situation that just⁠—it seems like it's turning and your gut is telling you to bounce, my friends, act like a ball and bounce. Do what you gotta do to take care. Also, do not start shit. Oh my goodness, do not in your rage, in your defensiveness, in your emotionalism, start shit with people without consideration. Find other ways of expressing and experiencing your emotions other than needing to have a fight with someone who you feel justified in reaction to. People are going to do that to you, maybe. You might do that to someone else. You might be witnessing that happening in your friend group, even though you yourself are not involved. That's just the energy of Mars square Pluto.

This transit brings about power struggles. It brings about, again, compulsive ego energies, which can lead to all manner of bad behavior. And depending on your nature, that could be self-harm, and it could be shutting down, and it could be acting out. A lot of people act out under this energy. This transit is confrontational in nature. Both Mars and Pluto, but really especially Mars, is confrontational and aggressive. If you feel the urge to try to control the way other people do things, be careful because you may be driven by an energy or you may approach it with an energy that creates more harm than good.

This is a time where you can get a lot out of being interested in the function of your ego and your relationship to entitlement and anger and control and competitiveness. But sometimes the Universe likes to teach these lessons in the most unpleasant of ways by forcing you to deal with these themes. So the more you do to try to be aware of those themes within you and in your life the better. Now, on the flip side, you may feel victimized, and you may be victimized. But on that tip, again, it's important to look at if you are participating in self-fulfilling prophecies, if you are in any way playing small as a way to avoid other people's heavy or shitty energy, because that's not going to work either.

Mars square Pluto can kick up jealousy, paranoia, cruelty, relentlessness, manipulation, and the conscious or unconscious drive to have dominion over others or over situations. So it's sticky. It's messy. These are hard topics. These are hard themes, but they're important ones to be aware of. And if that wasn't enough to make you a little nervous or uncomfortable, I got another couple of transits for you. We've got on the 2nd an exact square between Mercury and Neptune and an exact trine between Mercury and Saturn. And of course, the Mars/Pluto square and the Mercury square to Neptune are overlapping with each other right on the heels of this super emo New Moon in Cancer.

So Mercury square Neptune provokes anxiety. This transit can make it so that you are completely confused, and it can be that you have dealt with or you're dealing with somebody who's being duplicitous, somebody who is not being honest, and it can be that your head just feels scrambled and all over the place. This transit can make you feel exhausted, demoralized, kind of helpless or hopeless⁠—super fun. I'm sorry. That's sarcasm. But it's a rough transit. This is not a transit associated with mental clarity. And so, if you have to make major decisions, if you have to sign contracts, if you have to make agreements, this is not a good time for doing that at all. It's just not.

And when you pair this information of the Mercury square to Neptune with the Mars square to Pluto, I mean, anxiety and a lack of clarity, confusion, paired with defensiveness and aggression⁠—it can be real messy. You may not be understanding a situation accurately. Your strongest emotions are not reliably your wisest emotions, your most informed emotions. There is not only one way to deal with a situation, and in many situations, even ones where you feel terribly urgent, it is actually not necessary to respond immediately. Sometimes it is, yes, but you don't always have to. You don't always have to.

And under these transits, you may put yourself out there in the heat of the moment in a way that just makes you feel terrible afterwards, like an oversharing hangover, or, "Why did I say it that way?" pit in your stomach. Nobody wants that. But unfortunately, these transits can really bring them up. You know I like to talk about drugs, and in fact⁠—quick side note⁠—if you took my High Times and Addiction class on June 4th or you've bought the class since and watched it, please do go to my website and register for my Ask Me Anything, AMA, on July 17th, where we're going to just dive into your questions. Just as me anything about drugs, addiction, substance use, all that kind of good stuff. Anyways, July 17th. You can register on my website.

But to that tip, this is a terrible time for doing drugs. Consciousness-raising drugs⁠—don't do it. Don't do it. In general, if you have any kind of sensitivity to substances, do not do them during either of these transits. This week is not for that. There's going to be enough bananas energy around, and why bring more bananas to a banana party?

So, about the anxiety part of Neptune/Mercury square, the anxiety part is really important because sometimes we feel anxiety just because we're taking in too much information, and we don't have good energetic boundaries, which is very Neptunian. And so this is a moment to really check in with whether or not you are using the tools that you have around boundaries. And this might be something that is behavioral, something you express in your behavior or with your words to other people, and it may be just your energy work juj. And that's something I talk about a lot on my Patreon and a fair amount here.

If you are that kind of woo, this is a very important week, and especially on and around this date. It's an important time to practice having energetic boundaries. Do your shielding work because what happens under this transit is we get flooded by too much information; it's like the veils are thinner, so we get flooded by too much information, and our mind⁠—a.k.a. Mercury⁠—goes, "Ahh, I don't know what to do with this." And so we may randomly focus on lots of things without having a clear way of synthesizing them. We may just kind of hit overwhelm and either shut down or act out. It's not the greatest.

The other thing that can happen is that we are actively misled or we have made connections that aren't really there. And so, again, if you find yourself feeling anxious on and around this date, it's likely to have kind of a sharpness to it, an edge to it, because of that Mars/Pluto square. And I cannot say this strongly enough: be kind to yourself. Be empathetic to others. This is a rough time, and if you're feeling rough, you don't have to be like, "What's wrong with me? Why am I feeling this way?" You know now it's not what's wrong with you. It's, how can you take care of yourself? What do you need in this moment or for this situation? Because hey, man, it's Cancer season. Let's slather a little intimacy, a little empathy, a little kindness all over the place. It's very Cancer vibes.

And it's important to note that all of these transits that we're talking about, they can bring up kind of interpersonal dynamics that are hard and stressy, but they're unlikely to create brand-new problems out of thin air. These transits, especially the last two transits I'm talking to you about⁠—Mercury square Neptune and Mars square Pluto⁠—are going to exaggerate or amplify things that already exist. And if we're willing to cope with what is real, we can make changes. We can make shifts. We can evolve. That's effective, and it's effective in everybody's life regardless of circumstance, regardless of zodiac sign, etc.

Now, there is one more transit for me to tell you about that is exact on the 2nd, and that is Mercury trine Saturn. Now, this one is kind of getting lost in the mix of all this heavy fucking energy, but Mercury trine Saturn is stabilizing. It is⁠—I don't want to call it wind beneath our wings, because Saturn is not that windy. It is a transit that is a support for us steadying our minds and staying connected to our integrity, to reality, to our responsibilities. And it can be steadying for the power struggles that we may be tempted to engage in, whether in our behavior or in our thinking, because Saturn is nothing if not steadying and grounding. So this Mercury trine to Saturn is a nice companion to these other messy, sticky transits that we're in.

Now, my loves, my astro nerds, I'm going to run through the transits one more time just in case you're not using Astrology For Days, my transit-tracking tool over at astrologyfordays.com. And here we go. On the 27th, we have two exact transits. Mercury is forming an exact sextile to Chiron, and Mars is forming an exact sextile to Saturn. On the 28th, we have a New Moon in Cancer, exact at 7:52 p.m. Pacific Time. We also have an exact Sun square to Jupiter and an exact Venus sextile to Jupiter. On the 1st of July, Mars forms an exact square to Pluto. And on the 2nd of July, Mercury forms an exact square to Neptune and an exact trine to Saturn. And that, my friends, is all she wrote.

I want to thank you so much for joining me for Ghost of a Podcast this week and every week, and I want to let you know if you're in the Bay Area⁠—and this is⁠—it's a month in advance, but let me let you know if you're in the Bay Area, I am beyond honored to be a part of the Oakland Museum of California's upcoming art exhibition called Hella Feminist. I am so honored, like I can't even tell you. Blowing my mind to get to be doing this. I'm going to be a part of Hella Feminist in Oakland, and that opens July 29th. If you're local, you should come because in it, I am creating a portal, a literal portal, to come and release grief and rage and frustration, all the feelings that we have been collectively going through, that you have been personally going through, into this portal as a way of achieving some measure of catharsis because we have been going through such a hard time.

And no matter how strong you are, no matter how great things are going, we are all affected by it. And it is really important, in my view, to check in with our emotions and to check in with our spiritual body and to clean house now and again. And that's what this piece is all about. It is something I'm really thrilled and honored to be able to do. And again, if you're in the Bay Area or you're going to be in the Bay Area, this show is going to be open for six months, I believe, but it opens on July 29th. So put that in your little calendars and come see me. Come see it. Come see me.

Okay. Take care of yourself and others, and I will talk to you next week. Buh-bye.